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Discussion Starter #1
Hi Guys - Its been a while since I have been on here but still I'm riding my Meanie.

My question is about riding the Meanie with aftermarket filter and pipes with the fuel controller set at zero/ no fuel controller - I know a while back a number of people on the forum claimed to be doing this and I was wondering if that was still the case and if there had been any long term problems with doing it?

I have had a PC III on my bike for a while which seems to make it run rich and not add much to performance , my insurance provider wants to load my premium for having one so I have decided to take it off as I don't think its adding anything- I'm just a little concerned it will run too lean.

I don't have access to dynos so that is not an option ( If I did I would have tunes the PC III) and I do remember a number of folk on here talking about running zero.

I am running a 360 K+N car filter( Cadman style) on the RH side (cross over removed) and cut down V&H longshots.

Thanks for your help

Ponkster (Chris)
 

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Discussion Starter #2
No one willing to offer an opinion ? Its not legally binding you know - I just remember lots of people in the past talking about zero setting on the PC III and wondered if they were still running zeros and the valves hadn't melted !

Lots of views but no opinions it seems
 

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Personally I have never understood that people are using PC III and running it with zero map - and then telling about the positive effects (one has better mileage, one has better throttle response, one has better acceleration etc.). I still cannot understand, because just using zero maps means that PC III is not changing anything in fuel map.
If there are some other features which might be used while using zero map, then it should be definitely mentioned because it is totally different issue than "just using zero map".

I do not mean to be rude or anything like that to anyone, I'm just wondering :)
 

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No one willing to offer an opinion ? Its not legally binding you know - I just remember lots of people in the past talking about zero setting on the PC III and wondered if they were still running zeros and the valves hadn't melted !

Lots of views but no opinions it seems

Seven Exhaust Systems for Kawasaki Vulcan 1500 Mean Streak Motorcycle | Motorcycle Cruiser

In the article you can read about the influence of different aftemarket exhaust systems on the AF ratio. I (we) don't know what your system is doing. Anyway - for tuning you would need the lambda readings.

My Streak has a K&N air filter but stock pipes. I do not run a PC or fuel manager (= zero map) but rarely turn above 5000 and hardly need a high-speed enrichment the pipes mentioned above need. Indeed my Streak seems to run a bit lean up to 2400 rpm (IMO not due to the filter mod). To make a long story short: my valves have not melted yet.

PS I'd rather be concerned about the pipes than the filter (as for lean condition).
 

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Personally I have never understood that people are using PC III and running it with zero map - and then telling about the positive effects (one has better mileage, one has better throttle response, one has better acceleration etc.). I still cannot understand, because just using zero maps means that PC III is not changing anything in fuel map.
If there are some other features which might be used while using zero map, then it should be definitely mentioned because it is totally different issue than "just using zero map".


I do not mean to be rude or anything like that to anyone, I'm just wondering :)
My hundredth posting goes to......Jarmoke, Finland: You are not alone.:)

The unmentioned feature is the accelerator pump function of the PC.
 

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I borrowed a pc3 once and put it on my Voyager. It tanked my fuel economy with no noticeable change in power or operating temperature. I returned it and now keep all my bikes stock.
 

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"Best to have others suspect you an A-hole than open your mouth and prove it. or something like that I think? LOL
 

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:stfu: Lets take a poll and the loser leaves the site...FOREVER
 

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I've been running a zero map for about 3 years now, mainly because I'm to lazy to remove the PCIII, I am using the accelerator pump feature on it and that seems to make the initial deliver when I grab a handful of throttle a little quicker. I like many others, couldn't get it to quit running rich with the PCIII.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I didn't realise this was going to turn into a ***** Fest !

I do know about the Accelerator Pump function - I was running it when I had the PC III connected.

I also understand as with most bikes that one mode ( either pipes or air filter) doesn't need any fuel management - so I was most interested to hear from people running stock fuelling with aftermarket pipes and filters. I am running a pancake "spectra" filter (like a K+N) attached to the RH side into the throttle body and my pipes ate cut down Vance and Hinnes Long shots.

I think I will be keeping the PCIII on ( putting it back on that is !!!) and turning down the fuel down a bit across the range - not exactly scientific I know - feel free to **** your pants about that but remember if your known to be a serial knob on this forum I probably wont be able to see your comments so save your bile for someone who gives a flying **** !
To all the others who posted helpful comments - thanks , still seems a bit of debate on if we need a fuel controller but I guess slightly rich is a lot safer than running lean and hot on long runs.
 

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I didn't realise this was going to turn into a ***** Fest !

I do know about the Accelerator Pump function - I was running it when I had the PC III connected.

I also understand as with most bikes that one mode ( either pipes or air filter) doesn't need any fuel management - so I was most interested to hear from people running stock fuelling with aftermarket pipes and filters. I am running a pancake "spectra" filter (like a K+N) attached to the RH side into the throttle body and my pipes ate cut down Vance and Hinnes Long shots.

I think I will be keeping the PCIII on ( putting it back on that is !!!) and turning down the fuel down a bit across the range - not exactly scientific I know - feel free to **** your pants about that but remember if your known to be a serial knob on this forum I probably wont be able to see your comments so save your bile for someone who gives a flying **** !
To all the others who posted helpful comments - thanks , still seems a bit of debate on if we need a fuel controller but I guess slightly rich is a lot safer than running lean and hot on long runs.
Ponkster, I am running a spike air filter and Hard Krome exhaust. I'm not having any problems with running too lean.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Ponkster, I am running a spike air filter and Hard Krome exhaust. I'm not having any problems with running too lean.
Thanks for the reply - I see in your sig you have a PCIII - do you run it at zero map ? Do you use the accelerator pump function? How long have you been running the bike this way ?
 

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As per my last post, zero map about 4 years and I am running the accelerator pump function. That seems to give it more immediate umph when I grab a handful of throttle. The only reason the PCIII is still on the bike is I'm to lazy to take it off. I'll probably remove it altogether the next time I have to take the tank off for something else.
 

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Hey guys, old post but i thought i'd throw my $.02 in.

I do not have much experience with bikes in regard to A/F ratios and how the pipes and intake effect things, but i have a wealth of knowledge in this subject when it comes to V8's. Using OEM carb, Edelbrocks, and all manner of Holley/Quick-fuel/Demon carbs I have been able to adjust air-fuel ratios to exact specifications, using vacuum advance, timing, jets, air bleeds, and a few other tricks. All of this verified by real time driving conditions, data-logged through a wide band 02 sensor.

long story short, acceptable A/F ratios are actually pretty generous, and an engine will run forever a little rich, but pre-detonate/destroy pistons running lean. Basically, err on the side of rich when in doubt. Considering the Mean streaks are a closed loop system, you can just trick the input air temp sensor with a resistor to make it think the air is colder, and it needs to add more fuel. if the bikes had 02 sensors, then it would be totally different.

I have grinded out hours of time fine tuning A/F curves to get ever bit of power of engines, or increase MPG. It's a lot of work, and the results are good, but barely noticeable. IMO on these bikes, do the pipes and filter then add a 750 or 1,000 ohm resistor and call it good. Plenty of guys on here with that set up, and no adverse effects.
 

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Considering the Mean streaks are a closed loop system, you can just trick the input air temp sensor with a resistor to make it think the air is colder, and it needs to add more fuel. if the bikes had 02 sensors, then it would be totally different.
Yes, if the bikes had 02 sensors it could be totally different, like potentially closed loop instead of the open loop system our Mean Streaks have. Unfortunately our ECUs are primitive, open loop, and smart as a rock.

Adding resistance to trick the air temp sensor we've been doing forever. It fell from favor when we got PCII/PCIIIs and could richen and lean selectively instead of just adding fuel everywhere so your already too rich full throttle A/F ratios are even richer when you add a resistor.

The other problem adding a resistor is it's not a consistent "correction" over varied air temps, You need temp compensated resistance like "booster plugs" supply to get consistency.

The reason there's no good answer to the "do I need a PCIII (or similar)?" question is because the TPS settings our bikes were delivered with vary widely. It's why some bikes would run nicely on regular while others would detonate even on premium. With the common "big three" some bikes run ok with no mapping changes, some don't, many owners wouldn't know the difference anyway.
 
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