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Hello folks. So my 2013 650r had a hole blown through the piston head and it's gonna cost about the same for a new engine as it would to replace it. I was wondering if anyone here knew if a 2016-2017 engine would work with me 2013 650r. I'm asking since I don't know if there is a difference in the frame mounts or anything or if the dimensions are the same in my 2013. It's gonna be some work to do this but I'd rather see if I could just get a whole new engine and prevent this from happening again. I found a deal on a 2017 engine with only 348 miles on it and wanted to know before I pulled the trigger on the purchase. Thanks for all the input.
 

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2017, almost certainly not. 2016, very high chance yes (but make sure).

2017 is when the new gen of Kawasaki Ninja 650 came out. You want an engine from your same generation. The Ninja 650 line is a bit confusing, and the 2013 is around the time when the previous Ninja 650 model came out. Personally, I don't exactly recall when the -2016 gen came out, whether it was 2012, 2013 or 2014 (but it will be one of those years). Regrettably, you probably aren't going to find anyone willing to guarantee compatibility, but just make sure which generation your 650 is and stick to that. It should be a relatively bolt-on replacement if you do so. It might also be worth checking out ebay listings for ER-6N, 650R and ER-6F in the odd chance there's a good deal under that reference.
 

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We meet again. Thanks for the advice. I think i'll play it safe and find a 2013 model engine since most of them don't accept returns. I'll have to find a time and place to get all this done but I think it's the best/ most logical option for longterm results here. The running price rn is about 900-1k on these engines so we'll see what comes of it.
 

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Hello folks. So my 2013 650r had a hole blown through the piston head and it's gonna cost about the same for a new engine as it would to replace it. I was wondering if anyone here knew if a 2016-2017 engine would work with me 2013 650r. I'm asking since I don't know if there is a difference in the frame mounts or anything or if the dimensions are the same in my 2013. It's gonna be some work to do this but I'd rather see if I could just get a whole new engine and prevent this from happening again. I found a deal on a 2017 engine with only 348 miles on it and wanted to know before I pulled the trigger on the purchase. Thanks for all the input.
As I understand it - the 'new' generation 650 has different running gear and aesthetics, but still the same motor. It's easier for Kawasaki to redesign a frame around an existing motor than to do a new motor AND frame. I'm willing to bet that the 2017 will fit. Scroll down to #Performance - it's the same donk - but throttled down more for emissions control.

https://news.maxabout.com/bike-comparisons/kawasaki-ninja-650-old-model-vs-new-model/

Try researching - it can be fun and educational. Also read this:.

https://www.revzilla.com/common-tread/2017-kawasaki-ninja-650-first-ride-motorcycle-review
 

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As I understand it - the 'new' generation 650 has different running gear and aesthetics, but still the same motor. ... I'm willing to bet that the 2017 will fit.
You're right, it is "the same engine", grossly speaking. But would you bet 1000k$ of your own money (if you were in the OP's situation) that between 2013 and 2017 every connector, plug and bolt thread is in the exact same location, and that no unmentioned changes were made? Not even the air filter is compatible between 2016 and 2017. I've had both N650 years and working on them feels similar but not identical. The air box was completely redesigned. The frame was redesigned. That really isn't the type of suggestion I'd make to someone without first-hand evidence of compatibility considering the consequences of being wrong. Likewise, if the engine is the same there is little to gain by taking the risk of getting a different gen motor.

Now if the engine is returnable, the price is right and returning is feasible, then sure, it would definitely worth a try. But that doesn't seem to be the case.
 

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You're right, it is "the same engine", grossly speaking. But would you bet 1000k$ of your own money (if you were in the OP's situation) that between 2013 and 2017 every connector, plug and bolt thread is in the exact same location, and that no unmentioned changes were made? Not even the air filter is compatible between 2016 and 2017. I've had both N650 years and working on them feels similar but not identical. The air box was completely redesigned. The frame was redesigned. That really isn't the type of suggestion I'd make to someone without first-hand evidence of compatibility considering the consequences of being wrong. Likewise, if the engine is the same there is little to gain by taking the risk of getting a different gen motor.

Now if the engine is returnable, the price is right and returning is feasible, then sure, it would definitely worth a try. But that doesn't seem to be the case.
Well, before buying I would ensure that the engine could be mounted in the frame - that all mounting points are the same. As for connectors, they can be changed. Airbox? - probably changed for the alteration in performance and to fit the new frame. Wouldn't be hard to check if the earlier model fits the later model motor. "The frame was redesigned." Redundant comment - everyone already knows that, we are talking about the motor. So, to my mind it's not an unreasonable belief that the motor would fit...but whatever, it's up to the OP to do the research.

EDIT: Go on Kawasaki Partshouse and look at the exploded view of the crankcases for 2013 and 2017 models - identical - right down to the individual part numbers, and crankcase bolt pattern. Cylinder heads - same. So yeah - I would put money on that I'm right....I look forward to your counter argument debating the facts.
 

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I look forward to your counter argument debating the facts.
It must be nice to be able to speculate on someone else's dime and time. I'm sure that 95% of parts are identical - no one's debating that. And of course that includes most individual interior part numbers. We're only fussing about if there's a difference about some unknown 5%. But the fact that you say "the connectors can be changed" (if necessary) conceeds that differences are a real possibility. And the OP already mentioned that he doesn't exactly have a nice home garage where to take this on as a long winter project (in the OP's other thread). He appears to be looking for a quick bolt-on replacement.

Since you asked for a counter argument, then the 2013 crankcase set is Part #14001-0556, the 2017 crankcase set is Part #14001-0662. For reference, the 2013 Kawasaki Ninja 300 crankcase set (obviously incompatible) is #14001-0610. So Kawasaki's official stance is that they are not the same engine case per part number. As in, if ordered, you wouldn't get the same part. Though don't get me wrong, if you say sometimes the part# differs for identical parts, I'd agree. But it certainly can't be considered irrefutable evidence that they are identical.

"The frame was redesigned." Redundant comment - everyone already knows that, we are talking about the motor.
Unless you intend to mount the motor to something other than the frame, that's a main issue (not the inside parts). I'd be really pissed if I purchased a newer motor and found a missing or relocated unnecessary thread from a redesign. If you can provide evidence that all the mounting points are the same, I'd be glad to say it's likely bolt-on. But if not, it just isn't reasonable to take "it's all exactly the same" as the answer by default.

Your details aren't anything disputed. It's just that they don't provide confirmation. I'd be more than happy to correct myself if someone says "Yup, I put a 2017-2018 engine in a 2013 Gen N650 and no modifications were required". It would be something valuable to learn. But everything else has a degree of speculation attached. I'm not saying it can't be done regardless of whether they are absolutely identical - I'm sure it can, and would make a fun and not that hard project. But it's the difference between being able to do the swap with a ratchet kit, or on the other hand with an angle grinder, welder, soldering iron, crimp kit, tap and die set, etc.

The question is about a "2013 650r engine swap with a 16-17 650r engine". And by swap I understand quick direct-replacement with no modifications needed and no unintended defects (error codes) created in the process. The OP hasn't presented themselves as an experienced DIYer so it's a fair assumption. You seem to be including a retrofit in the question, in which case I'd agree the 2017 is a perfect candidate. But they're different questions. In any case, I've seen enough compatibility issues between 2016 and 2017 to not be willing to give that advice without previous personal experience. Specially not on a 1000$ engine for a 3000$ bike that you need ready yesterday. If you do, good for you and for whoever takes it.

In any case,let's not get too ruffled up. This is all in good spirits about an interesting topic.
 

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"Unless you intend to mount the motor to something other than the frame, that's a main issue." Look at the frame exploded views - 2017 has many more brackets for THE SAME MOTOR to fit the new frame. "The question is about a "2013 650r engine swap with a 16-17 650r engine". And by swap I understand quick direct-replacement with no modifications needed." I believe that is the case...but whatever dude - you are the all-seeing guru of Ninjas. Good for you. The topic really isn't of great concern to me. Read my signature. See ya.
 

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...but whatever dude - you are the all-seeing guru of Ninjas. Good for you. The topic really isn't of great concern to me. Read my signature. See ya.
LOL. Someone takes the internet too seriously! Show me on the doll where the online troll touched you ;)
 

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LOL. Someone takes the internet too seriously! Show me on the doll where the online troll touched you ;)
No..I take ignorance and stupidity too seriously...and I don't know why I continue to do so after being a teacher/lecturer for over 20 years...however I'm still continually surrounded by it, you know - drowning man syndrome - struggling against an overwhelming tide of ignorance and stupidity. One would think that I should be inured to it and yet here I am, still offended by both notions.

But hey, you occasionally post some reasonably good stuff, for a millennial that is, so maybe there's hope for you yet.

btw - the doll reference. Have you ever worked in child protection and had to ask some little girl who has been sexually abused to show where she has been touched? I bet ...no. Well Sunshine, I have. It's not funny, it's not pleasant, it's no joking matter and it's traumatic for the child involved. So keep that smart-arse garbage to yourself. It's very indicative of your level of maturity.
 

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Hello folks. So my 2013 650r had a hole blown through the piston head and it's gonna cost about the same for a new engine as it would to replace it. I was wondering if anyone here knew if a 2016-2017 engine would work with me 2013 650r. I'm asking since I don't know if there is a difference in the frame mounts or anything or if the dimensions are the same in my 2013. It's gonna be some work to do this but I'd rather see if I could just get a whole new engine and prevent this from happening again. I found a deal on a 2017 engine with only 348 miles on it and wanted to know before I pulled the trigger on the purchase. Thanks for all the input.
There's a good chance it will fit.
Ninja 250R owners have done Ninja 300 engine swap with relative ease.

2016 ad 2017 Ninja 650 engines are very similar (almost identical), with some tweaking obviously.

The crankcase bolt pattern is identical between 2016 and 2017+.
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/56e729a287a8660e60bbdc3b/crankcase-bolt-pattern
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/5aec92c387a86610c8a4ea2f/crankcase-bolt-pattern

The cylinder head gasket was identical, however the design of cylinder head was little different, probably due to new 36mm throttle body and some tweaks they made, but a lot of parts remained identical.
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/56e729a187a8660e60bbdc2d/cylinder-head
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/5aec92c387a86610c8a4ea21/cylinder-head

If you look at the engine cover, it is very obvious that design was different.
But this is probably due to slipper clutch. The clutch looks totally different.
However, despite the different design, the gasket remained identical, which means, the engine block was identical and only the surface design of engine/clutch over was different, but bolt pattern, gasket shape, etc...remained identical.
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/56e729a287a8660e60bbdc3c/engine-cover-s
https://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oemparts/a/kaw/5aec92c387a86610c8a4ea30/engine-cover-s
 
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