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MotoMacGyver
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2,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Can anyone direct me to the post about removing that big hulking black box underneath the seat to free up some storage area? It's the one with 3 rubber tubes coming into it. I know it was discussed before on this forum or the "old" one.

P.S. Was there any ill-effects from removing it? Rough running, mileage, performance, etc.?

Thanks,

Emrah
 

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West Coast Moderator
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12,996 Posts
WHOA! EASY! DON'T SAY "OLD SITE". I took a severe thrashing for that one!

I don't think we got into taking out the "black box", but we did get into taking out the stuff under the tank. That one is on the home page under maintenance.

After looking at the mounting, I was thinking about moving the box on my bike to the side instead of right in the middle. Wouldn't take much to do, but it would require drilling more holes.
 

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MotoMacGyver
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2,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Martin,

Read about the EGR removal; seems easy enough. My question is does it help anything? As you know, I have a bone stock -7. No jets, filters, pipe, or anything. Am I going to benefit from taking this stuff off or is it not worth my while?

Emrah

P.S. I think that this (as I write this) is the only time I've been on and haven't seen your name as logged on. Come on, how do you expect to get to 300 posts if you're slacking like this?:~

Emrah
 

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West Coast Moderator
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I'm doin' it...if for no other reason, just for the space.

More good stuff!:cool:
 

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West Coast Moderator
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I did it. And the extra room is good for water bottles and all kinds of great stuff. But I'm thinking that some kinda filter should go on the yellow stripe hose. When I stuck my thumb over it to check for vacuum, the idle dropped and it almost died. I didn't follow the hose forward, but is it a internal control or an external control? What I mean is, will it suck up junk and get it somewhere it shouldn't be? The book doesn't really say much about it.
 

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West Coast Moderator
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After a short nap I decided to go down and finish off project "No Smog". I left the yellow stripe hose alone for now. I removed the re-burn junk and made a cool discovery. The large hose that runs down the spine of the bike works as a cross over for the valve cover doo-dads. So I cut a chunk outa that and put the stock clamps back on. Works just fine. I removed the air box and seen the maze of hoses and decided those gotta go. The bulk of the maze was for the separator. Since I already removed the "black box" I had hoses that lead to nothing. The red and blue stripe hoses that come off the left side of the tank go to that separator. What I did was remove the separator, remove the blue hose going to the tank and replaced it with the blue hose that went from the separator to the "black box". I then zip tied it to the red stripe hose and ran both of them between the frame and swing arm like all the other over flow hoses. Also on the separator "package" is a white stripe vacuum hose that runs from the bottom of the separator to carb #3. I removed that hose and plugged the nipple off.

Now, let's readdress the yellow hose. Originally it comes off the left side if the "black box" and runs to a "T". Those lines then run down between carbs 1&2 and 3&4. I'm thinking that I can run that hose to the air box. On the front of the air box is a connection where the green stripe hose (that ran from the air box to the "black box") was. What do you think?
 

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Silver Member
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479 Posts
Hi, Martin
Instead of working on turkey, you worked on EPA junk. Not good.
There are few things I can clarify.

But I'm thinking that some kinda filter should go on the yellow stripe hose. When I stuck my thumb over it to check for vacuum, the idle dropped and it almost died.
That's correct. Yellow stripe hose it's a breather for carb float bowls. When you plugged it on running engine, pressure in the bowls dropped and fuel stopped to go to the engine. On non-california bikes this hose goes just to atmosphere, no filters here. There is no air flow, this hose just to equalize pressure.

What I did was remove the separator, remove the blue hose going to the tank and replaced it with the blue hose that went from the separator to the "black box". I then zip tied it to the red stripe hose and ran both of them between the frame and swing arm like all the other over flow hoses.
What I would do (what I will do later), it's to plug the blue and red stripe nipples on the tank and to remove small rubber grommet over the fuel tank cap. If you open the cap, you'll see the small hole in the center of the back side of the cap and a small nipple on the right side of the cap. This is a fuel tank breather. This small nipple connected to the blue stripe hose (when cap is closed) through the rubber grommet. By removing the grommet you're connecting breather to the overfill/rain drain hose. It's not obvious, but you can pull up the rubber funnel on the left side and you'll see the drain hole. Other way is to leave rubber grommet on it's place and route blue stripe hose together with overfill drain hose, like you did. This way is probably better than the first one, it's simplier. But you definitely should plug the red marked nipple. This is a fuel return and it goes directly to the tank. Thus, on bumps, you won't leak gas.

Now, let's readdress the yellow hose. Originally it comes off the left side if the "black box" and runs to a "T". Those lines then run down between carbs 1&2 and 3&4. I'm thinking that I can run that hose to the air box. On the front of the air box is a connection where the green stripe hose (that ran from the air box to the "black box") was.
Don't do this. Pressure in the airbox is lower than athmospheric, you don't want to redice the pressure in the float bowls. Plug the green stripe hose (to prevent nonfiltered air from going to the engine) and leave the yellow stripe hose alone.

All this california emission system works this way:
1. Engine isn't running. Vapors from the tank go through separator to the box through the blue stripe hose. Vapors from the float bowls go to the box through the yellow stripe hose. In the box, vapors go through charcoal pack to the atmosphere.
2. Engine is running. Vapors and gas spills go to the separator through blue and red stripe hoses. Separator sends vapors to the blue stripe hose and gas to the red stripe hose. Since pressure in airbox is lower than atmospheric, vapors from the box (together with some amount of atmospheric air filtered by charcoal pack) go to the airbox through green stripe hose.
 

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West Coast Moderator
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I thought alot about the green stripe hose last night and figured connecting it to the air box wouldn't be right. Thanks for the info on the red and blue stripes. I'm gonna go to the garage and see if I can't wrap this up this morning.

Oh, I worked on the turkey alright. (and stuffing and spuds & gravy and everything else within reach). Now it's "Jenny Craig"and "Slimfast" till x-mas.:cool:
 

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West Coast Moderator
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Everything worked fine right up to the point where the the vacuum caps I put on split (both of them). They were some old ones I had in my tool box and I'm not so sure I didn't split them putting them on. They were actually shipping plugs so they weren't rubber, they were more of a plastic/nylon material. No sweat. Go to the shop tomorrow morning and pick up a couple more. I don't forsee any improvement in performance. Mostly just cleaned it up a bit. Took off a few pounds of junk and a few yards of rubber hose that will come in handy for other projects or repairs. Thanks shuo! :cool:

BTW...I put the clear plastic catch bottle on the red stripe hose. That way it will catch the drips and won't let stuff back flow into the tank. I'll still have to empty it occassionally, but it's nothing more than I'm already doing.
 

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MotoMacGyver
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2,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
Ok, what exactly is a "separator" and what does it do? What does it look like?

Man, I really opened up a can of worms with this thread, huh?...

Can you guys post on here if you have any ill-effects from doing all this? Like a several-hundred mile update or something? It sounds like it would clear up a lot of space, but I really don't feel like messing with all that stuff (especially because I still don't have a factory service manual to refer to) and I'm not missing storage capacity THAT much to be bothered with it.

I guess I'm more of a learn-by-doing person. I've read and re-read your posts like 3 times already, but still have no clue about some of the things you're talking about. I'll attempt the project only if its' worthwhile with no ill effects.

Keep us updated though.

Emrah
 

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West Coast Moderator
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The "separator" is on the right side of the bike behind the grey side cover. It about the size of a large pill bottle and black in color. It has 2 blue strip hoses, one red stripe hose and one white strip hose coming out of the bottom. The red stripe and 1 blue stripe come from the left side of the gas tank and go to it. The other blue stripe goes between the separator and the "black box". The white stripe goes to #3 carb. If you want a real good look at it, pull your seat and gas tank and air intake box. You only have to pull the top and the piece immediately below it (the box the air cleaner fits in. It's only one screw). It will give you plenty of room to see and work (should you accept this mission).
 

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MotoMacGyver
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2,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Hey, speaking of pulling gas tanks, can you pull the tank on these things without leaking gas all over the place? I tried it on my old Yamaha Seca II, and the thing leaked everywhere. I looked at the "Removing the Gas Tank" article at the ZR-7.com site, but it doesn't say if it leaks or not. What stops the gas from leaking if you remove the lines before the pet****?

Emrah
 

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Silver Member
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479 Posts
Martin, let me congratulate you with your dirty, polluting like crazy bike. If in the next couple of years global temperature will rise up, we'll know who deserved the big thanks.
Emrah, I know, my english is good enough only to answer on "paper or plastic?", so keep reading. On 7-th or 8-th time you'll get the mental impulse.
Talking seriously, I recommend you to start with "No Smog Lite", i.e. remove the box, but leave the separator and hoses, like I did. I'm lazy, really lazy, so I didn't take all this hassle with this hose net under the airbox. I'll do it later. Advantage is that you can restore everything in 10 minutes if I won't like it. In my case it's 1500 miles without any side effects. And why side effects? We just brought bike to non-california spec. Remove the box, plug the green stripe hose, route two other hoses to the outside through holes in plastic near the lower grabrails. You can keep these hoses inside, but I store cargo net and tire repaire kit under the seat, and I don't want gas vapors here.
Separator separates liquid fraction from gaseous. It sends vapors to the box and liquid gas back to the tank. It uses vacuum spikes to perform this task, this is why there is a hose to the carbs.
 

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MotoMacGyver
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2,546 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Sounds simple enough. Guess I'll give it a shot when I feel motivated and the whether sucks and I can't ride. Better to fiddle if you can't ride, I guess.

P.S. This bad-word filter thing is getting a little ridiculous. If you notice, in my post above, it blanked out [email protected]#$# - you know, the fuel pet "male rooster". I can understand this is a family site and all, and the "biggie" bad words should be filtered, but blanking out our favourite 3-letter "rear-end" word and our favourite 5-letter "female dog" word is a bit much, don't ya think?

I mean for %$#%#$%'s sake. We're not that Deighty-Darned sensitive! What a Female Dog to have to decipher words with those #[email protected]#$ing "****" 's in place of actual letters huh? :eek:

Emrah
 

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West Coast Moderator
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12,996 Posts
Smog? It'll just go through the hole in the Ozone. No prob!
I don't know if it was a fluke, but after yanking all that junk out, I noticed a lack of hesitation at low rpm. I didn't get a chance to get it out on the road for a real world run yet. But I did get to do a low speed jaunt. I was mostly listening for vacuum leaks and when I was satisfied there wasn't any, I gave it a little gas and it was smoother than normal. So I did it a few more times and the normal hesitation/lurch was pretty much gone. Not all the way, but not near what it was. I'm kinda hoping once I adjust the mixture screws, it may take out the rest of it, or close to it.
 
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