RiderForums.com - Kawasaki Motorcycle Forum banner

1 - 20 of 44 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
so daily driving everyday, makes me realize what I want. I want the PULL power. I have a cb500x and planning on converting this to a rally raid (off road adventure dual sport kit)

I am looking at these bikes

Ninja 650
Ninja 1000
Z900
MT10
Tracer 900 GT


What I am looking for:

- something that can pull hard 0 - 70mph, 20/30mph - 70 - 80MPH
- comfort for long haul. seems all of these have that upright positioning
- something to tour state to state
- daily driving
- possible comfort for passenger once I add a universal rear seat


I guess my question is, which one really can pull hard and quickly while im rolling on 20-30mph to an instant(i wish) 80MPH?
power is definitely something I want, but also I cruise a lot on 80MPH (speed limit is 75 and 80 on some parts)

I really like the price and MPG of the 650, but not sure how it pulls and how it revs holding 80MPH


or should I bite the bullet and get the 1000 ninja? I mean if the 650 pulls just as hard 20mph - 80MPH and 80mph is the "sweet spot" of the 650, i might as well go with the 650 right?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
285 Posts
I'd say Ninja 1000, to be honest.

I think the Ninja 650 would also be fine, but you put a lot of emphasis on:
- Power
- Touring
- Passenger

Those three factor really make the Ninja 1000 as better choice.

If you would have put the emphasis on the following, then I'd say Ninja 650:
- Price
- MPG
- Weight and size
- City and suburban riding

Regarding the Z900 and MT10, being naked would also be a con in my book for long-distance riding, but that's up to you.

All in all, either of the five bikes would probably be fine. Pick whichever one you think will look nicest in your driveway ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
507 Posts
I agree with MillenialNinja's assessment. But I would point out that the Ninja 650, when properly outfitted, is an excellent long distance tourer for a solo rider. A friend told me that on closed track conditions and with a professional driver :), that the Ninja 650 is comfortable and stable well into the 120 mph range.

But if loads of power and a lot of two-up riding is in your future, then the N1K is the way. However, not knowing your height and not wanting to go look up the seat height on your CB500X right now, do try to get a test ride as shorties like me find the N1K a bit of a tip-toe, while professional basketball players are cramped on the Ninja650.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
970 Posts
I was not comfortable on the N1K for long distances. I eventually traded it in for a Versys 1000 which is much more comfortable, but less exciting.

For an exciting daily driver with good pull power, I'd have to go with the Tracer 900. If carrying a passenger is important to you, then I'd recommend going with one of the 1000s
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
23 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
thanks all! so this really points out to if my wife really wants to go often and its worth the extra money. such a hard decision with so many bikes around!!!

I do know the new 2018 and 2017 ninja 1000 is a more "sports adventure" type bike. My worry is the weight being 500lbs+ never handled a big bike ha ha.

I realllly like the new ninja 650 as well...so would you guys say it has the pull power I am looking for? say 20MPH to burst up to 80MPH on highways? or would a 1000 have more pull?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
285 Posts
I realllly like the new ninja 650 as well...so would you guys say it has the pull power I am looking for? say 20MPH to burst up to 80MPH on highways? or would a 1000 have more pull?
There's no definition for the "pull power I am looking for". I could say either yes or no, and no one could prove me wrong or right. Having the 2017 Ninja 650, I can say it has plenty of power and nerve to exceed any legal speeds, and plenty of acceleration to boot. However it isn't a supersport. If you're looking to pull off power wheelies in second or third at the flick of the wrist, it's not the right bike. Now if you just want an exciting bike with plenty of acceleration for real-world use, then the Ninja 650 is a home run.

In other words, the question has a lot more to do with what you want than what the bike is capable of.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
82 Posts
2015 Ninja 650 ABS rider here. Have it outfitted with a Corbin seat and tall windscreen. I'm a big guy (~290 lbs) and I use it as a daily commuter, weekend recreational rides, and long-distance touring. I rip off some consecutive 300-500 mile days in comfort, so a smaller guy shouldnt have any problem. As far as being a daily commuter goes, it loves the low end. Some guys gear it down a bit to go for even more low-end torque. It pulls nicely all the way to about 100. Sure, it may not run with the litre bikes, but it'll out-gun 99% of the cars you come across on the road. It runs stable at those higher speeds, as well. No issues going from 70 to 80 on a highway to execute a pass.

I bought mine thinking it'd be a 2-3 year stopgap until I get into a full sport-touring bike, but I'm into my third season now and I love the thing. Just bought a set of Givi hard bags for it yesterday and will be installing them this weekend.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,325 Posts
If you want pull power, you are talking about torque. Look at the torque numbers and where they fall in the RPM range for each bike.

The triple will probably have the better torque curve and twins rule when it comes to torque. When you get into the illegal speeds is when the inline 4s will shine.

There are plenty of videos out there where old beater Harleys blow away the sport bikes in launch.

https://video.search.yahoo.com/search/video;_ylt=AwrE1xoekjVbWY4A6AVXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTByMjB0aG5zBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzYw--?p=harley+beating+sport+bike+in+race&fr=mcafee

You need to figure out what you find comfortable and get out and do some test rides.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,192 Posts
Key phrase supplied by twa... "test rides". Only way YOU will know for sure what checks all your boxes.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
I bought a Ninja 650 in October, and it's a great bike for daily riding, BUT, it's not suited for two up riding beyond short trips out of necessity. It's not just passenger comfort, either. Unless you ride really mildly, it is not comfortable for rider either. It's comfortable enough solo for me to do long trips, but I have to travel light. I put 4300 miles on it week before last during a camping trip. I rode 30 hours to Colorado, only stopping for gas and nature, about 1600 miles. How tuff are ye? If most of my riding was going to be long trips, I would want a bigger bike. No matter what you choose, there will be compromises. You just have to decide what you are willing to give up, what you can live with, and which compromises will likely inconvenience you more often. If you're planning on a lot of two up riding, especially longer trips, you might be willing to give up lighter weight, maneuverability, fuel economy, and lower buy in to go with 1000 ccs. If you're like me, the 650 will be "better" most of the time, so you might be willing to sacrifice the advantages of bigger bikes. I rode gravel roads in the mountains like I thought I was on an adventure bike, but not as well as I might have on a 1200gs. Still, the Ninja CAN do some light off road work. I racked up miles on the interstate like I was on a Goldwing, but I know the GW would have done it more comfortably... A Busa would do it faster (ignoring speed limits), but the Ninja is fast enough, AND I averaged 55 mpg for the trip. I can live with the 650. The biggest PITA for me was chain maintenance, but I figured out how to strap the bike to a pole in order to lift the rear wheel off the ground, leaving the bike supported by the front tire, kickstand, and strap. If I upgrade, I'm looking really hard at the FJR1300 for the shaft drive and increased comfort without giving up performance.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
Yeah, test rides are helpful, but they won't tell you how you're going to feel after 4 hours in the saddle... I think it's worthwhile to do day rentals before committing to a purchase, especially when you start looking at bikes that cost $15-20k or more.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,325 Posts
I bought a Ninja 650 in October, and it's a great bike for daily riding, BUT, it's not suited for two up riding beyond short trips out of necessity. It's not just passenger comfort, either. Unless you ride really mildly, it is not comfortable for rider either. It's comfortable enough solo for me to do long trips, but I have to travel light. I put 4300 miles on it week before last during a camping trip. I rode 30 hours to Colorado, only stopping for gas and nature, about 1600 miles. How tuff are ye? If most of my riding was going to be long trips, I would want a bigger bike. No matter what you choose, there will be compromises. You just have to decide what you are willing to give up, what you can live with, and which compromises will likely inconvenience you more often. If you're planning on a lot of two up riding, especially longer trips, you might be willing to give up lighter weight, maneuverability, fuel economy, and lower buy in to go with 1000 ccs. If you're like me, the 650 will be "better" most of the time, so you might be willing to sacrifice the advantages of bigger bikes. I rode gravel roads in the mountains like I thought I was on an adventure bike, but not as well as I might have on a 1200gs. Still, the Ninja CAN do some light off road work. I racked up miles on the interstate like I was on a Goldwing, but I know the GW would have done it more comfortably... A Busa would do it faster (ignoring speed limits), but the Ninja is fast enough, AND I averaged 55 mpg for the trip. I can live with the 650. The biggest PITA for me was chain maintenance, but I figured out how to strap the bike to a pole in order to lift the rear wheel off the ground, leaving the bike supported by the front tire, kickstand, and strap. If I upgrade, I'm looking really hard at the FJR1300 for the shaft drive and increased comfort without giving up performance.
I agree with most of what you say except fuel economy. The way many 500 - 800 cc bikes are geared they don't get much better fuel economy than touring and sport touring bikes. My Triumph Trophy SE was luxury and averaged 60 mpg with a 7 gallon fuel tank.

My Harley Road Glide Special averages 50 mpg with the 107 ci Milwaukee Eight engine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
I agree with most of what you say except fuel economy. The way many 500 - 800 cc bikes are geared they don't get much better fuel economy than touring and sport touring bikes. My Triumph Trophy SE was luxury and averaged 60 mpg with a 7 gallon fuel tank.

My Harley Road Glide Special averages 50 mpg with the 107 ci Milwaukee Eight engine.
Ummm, yeah, but mileage depends a lot on how you ride... You get better mileage on your Trophy than I get on my Ninja, but you'll probably get better mileage than I do on the Ninja as well. The Ninja is capable of better than 55 mpg if you don't wind it out, and I suspect I might struggle to get the same 60 mpg you claim for your Trophy. Fuelly shows an average of low to mid 40s for the Trophy, and only slightly higher for the Ninja 650, but I'm thinking the average 650 rider is not going to be trying to ride economically most of the time, while riders on bigger, dedicated touring bikes probably spend a lot less time wringing them out and are likely to be more concerned about fuel consumption.

Fuel consumption may or may not be a primary consideration when choosing a bike, especially when the differences are not huge, but a few miles per gallon makes a significant difference over the long haul if one is concerned about such things.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,313 Posts
Fuel consumption may or may not be a primary consideration when choosing a bike, especially when the differences are not huge, but a few miles per gallon makes a significant difference over the long haul if one is concerned about such things.
"I'm buying it for the fuel economy!" - said no real biker ever.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
Fuel consumption may or may not be a primary consideration when choosing a bike, especially when the differences are not huge, but a few miles per gallon makes a significant difference over the long haul if one is concerned about such things.
"I'm buying it for the fuel economy!" - said no real biker ever.

I buy, mainly, looking for good fuel economy, then, just bellow that, performance; but that’s because my only transportation are motorcycles; I’ve never owned a car. I’m an all year round Arizona biker.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
I buy, mainly, looking for good fuel economy, then, just bellow that, performance; but that’s because my only transportation are motorcycles; I’ve never owned a car. I’m an all year round Arizona biker.
Exactly. Fuel economy is not necessarily the only consideration, or even the most important one, but it is a legit concern for a lot of "real bikers." When I was camping in Colorado, A guy pulled up with an F350, pulling a trailer. He rolled an Ultra out of the back and took off down Route 12, was gone just long enough to make the loop... I rode my Ninja 1600 miles in 30 hours to get there. Still, some people will say I'm not a "real biker," not that I really care. Dude probably got around 12 mpg pulling that trailer, which is fine if that's your thing (2 wheel supreme being probably would have gotten 20-30 mpg), but just because you don't care how much gas you burn doesn't mean nobody should. It's a little silly to imply that fuel economy is all that matters to a guy just because it's a concern, though. I bought my first bike primarily for economy, but I gave up some practicality for increased performance on the second purchase. People have differing needs, desires, values, and priorities. While economy of ownership is a concern for me, I'm not going to ride slowly all the time for the sake of fuel economy. I usually average around 50 mpg on my Ninja, and that's because I ride pretty hard a lot of the time. I think that's pretty good, but I'm not about to stop having fun on the bike to get another 10 mpg or so. If I only cared about fuel economy, I'd buy a 50cc scooter, but just because I got a Ninja 650 instead doesn't mean I don't care about fuel efficiency.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,325 Posts
Exactly. Fuel economy is not necessarily the only consideration, or even the most important one, but it is a legit concern for a lot of "real bikers." When I was camping in Colorado, A guy pulled up with an F350, pulling a trailer. He rolled an Ultra out of the back and took off down Route 12, was gone just long enough to make the loop... I rode my Ninja 1600 miles in 30 hours to get there. Still, some people will say I'm not a "real biker," not that I really care. Dude probably got around 12 mpg pulling that trailer, which is fine if that's your thing (2 wheel supreme being probably would have gotten 20-30 mpg), but just because you don't care how much gas you burn doesn't mean nobody should. It's a little silly to imply that fuel economy is all that matters to a guy just because it's a concern, though. I bought my first bike primarily for economy, but I gave up some practicality for increased performance on the second purchase. People have differing needs, desires, values, and priorities. While economy of ownership is a concern for me, I'm not going to ride slowly all the time for the sake of fuel economy. I usually average around 50 mpg on my Ninja, and that's because I ride pretty hard a lot of the time. I think that's pretty good, but I'm not about to stop having fun on the bike to get another 10 mpg or so. If I only cared about fuel economy, I'd buy a 50cc scooter, but just because I got a Ninja 650 instead doesn't mean I don't care about fuel efficiency.
My Harley Road Glide gets 50 mpg but I have it all stock. No loud pipes for me. As you can see in my Avatar, I have toured every state in the lower 48 by motorcycle. Due to a severe back injury I am now forced to trailer my bikes to where the good roads are. But at least I am still riding. Yes, I wince at how much fuel is costing me to haul bikes instead of riding them, but my other choice would be to just ride local, or trade it all in for a convertible.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,325 Posts
I buy, mainly, looking for good fuel economy, then, just bellow that, performance; but that’s because my only transportation are motorcycles; I’ve never owned a car. I’m an all year round Arizona biker.
So, I assume you are riding either a Honda NC700X, a Honda CB500X or a Honda CB500F.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,325 Posts
Ummm, yeah, but mileage depends a lot on how you ride... You get better mileage on your Trophy than I get on my Ninja, but you'll probably get better mileage than I do on the Ninja as well. The Ninja is capable of better than 55 mpg if you don't wind it out, and I suspect I might struggle to get the same 60 mpg you claim for your Trophy. Fuelly shows an average of low to mid 40s for the Trophy, and only slightly higher for the Ninja 650, but I'm thinking the average 650 rider is not going to be trying to ride economically most of the time, while riders on bigger, dedicated touring bikes probably spend a lot less time wringing them out and are likely to be more concerned about fuel consumption.

Fuel consumption may or may not be a primary consideration when choosing a bike, especially when the differences are not huge, but a few miles per gallon makes a significant difference over the long haul if one is concerned about such things.
If we were riding side by side and accelerating at the same rate you would be using more fuel than I would be. One up to legal speeds the aerodynamic design of my Trophy would trump yours for efficiency.

Part of the reason you see the lower numbers on fuely is because of the cross section of rider locations, riding styles, and the fact that most guys who buy sport touring bikes for some reason think they need to put risers and tall windshields on them which severely affects fuel economy. I live out in the country and when I tour it is on 2 to 4 lane state highways with routes that avoid traffic areas as much as possible.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
42 Posts
If we were riding side by side and accelerating at the same rate you would be using more fuel than I would be.
Not sure how you arrived at that conclusion... The Ninja weighs 200 lbs. less, and bone stock, is pretty aerodynamic when fully tucked. I haven't added any tall windscreens or anything, but I noticed the Trophy comes with a nice barn door. Consider me skeptical.
 
1 - 20 of 44 Posts
Top