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Discussion Starter #1
I pretty familiar how new car dealerships work when purchasing new. How much wiggle room will a motorcycle dealership have as far as coming off the MSRP price? I've seen prices in a 250 mile radius range from $7,100 to $5,888 for new. One dealership with the low end is 145 miles from where I live while the other is 30 miles. I would like to stay as local as I can so I can cultivate a good relationship with the local one. Just noy sure how much they will come off the $6,999 MSRP.

I know it shouldn't be to long before the 18' will be coming in so I'm thinking they will be motivated to sell the older inventory.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

David
 

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My suggestion is to stay local and build a relationship with your dealer even if it might cost you a few $$'s more up front because in my experience it will pay off in the long run.
With that said I have two dealers about 50 miles away in opposite directions and I just never clicked with one of the dealership. You might find yourself in the same situation so I would visit a couple of them and see how you feel one way or another.

As for the bike I pd $550 under MSRP for my Z900 two weeks ago plus 4 qts oil / oil filter and that was from the dealer as Kawi had no incentives out yet besides the Jacket. Buy now and ride now or wait longer to save $100/ $200 is the question lol
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Gotcha! Think I would rather start to learning to ride now:) I agree if they can get fairly close to the low end I would much rather stay local.

Thanks

David
 

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Have you taken the MSF class yet? That should be your first order of business.

Bike mark up is about 13% based on all the sources I have found.

Manufacturers sometimes offer incentives that the dealer may or may not pass on to the buyer depending if they think they have a live one on the hook. So, look up the manufacturers websites for the bikes you are interested in and see what incentives they offer and make sure you let the dealer know you know.

Dealers charge different fees on top of the purchase price. Setup and prep, freight, paperwork fees, blah blah blah. Make sure you find out the Out the Door price on the bikes so you are not surprised.

Japanese bikes depreciate like rocks so make sure you really want a new one before buying. You can find 3 year old ones with 3000 miles for thousands less than new.

Good Luck. I have owned 20 bikes in the past 10 years.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Gonna sign up complete and pass the MSF before I start riding the new bike. There offer a class twice a month that is located 50 miles from where I live.

Thanks for the notice on japanese bike depreciation.

David
 

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Personally, I'd recommend a good low mileage bike rather than a brand new one for a couple reasons. First off, you might accidently drop the bike while learning. It happens. Then you'll be fixing it (expensive) or riding around with the broken or scratched up bike. Second is cost. Like we all know, they lose a lot value as soon as they get sold so, let someone else take the hit on depreciation instead of yourself. That way if you don't like riding motorcycles, or just want a different type bike in the future it will be easier and cheaper in the long run. Just my opinion. (BTW, my uncle flew 105s ( aThud) in early Vietnam)
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Personally, I'd recommend a good low mileage bike rather than a brand new one for a couple reasons. First off, you might accidently drop the bike while learning. It happens. Then you'll be fixing it (expensive) or riding around with the broken or scratched up bike. Second is cost. Like we all know, they lose a lot value as soon as they get sold so, let someone else take the hit on depreciation instead of yourself. That way if you don't like riding motorcycles, or just want a different type bike in the future it will be easier and cheaper in the long run. Just my opinion. (BTW, my uncle flew 105s ( aThud) in early Vietnam)
Thank you for the input in regards to purchasing a low milage bike.

My father was stationed at Korat 67-68 and again in 72-73. Crew chief on the D model and Line chief on the G respectively. He said that the Thud drivers had big brass ones and had much respect for them.

If your uncles is still living please tell him I said thank you for his service to our country and if he has passed I will say a prayer and thank him. Sorry to get off topic.

David
 

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Thud pilots had the highest losses of the war till they got the F4 phantom to replace them. Everyone, myself included were military.
 

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There's not a huge amount of wiggle room so don't expect the price tumble. New bike prices are super competitive right now. Negotiate a good deal on some riding gear if you need it. Dealers make their money from finance deals, accessories, gear and long term customers returning for services and more. A good relationship built with a local dealer is worth more than the lowest price you can find.

Personally I wouldn't buy a new bike as my first, but enjoy that awesome new bike feeling if you do!
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thud pilots had the highest losses of the war till they got the F4 phantom to replace them. Everyone, myself included were military.
You are correct Sir. They lost over half of the 800 + A/C produced . In the early years the Thuds flew over 75% of the bombing missions hence the loss rate. Route Pack Six was the missions where they suffered high attrition rates, Many Thud drivers not killed in the initial crash spent time at the Hanoi Hilton. Later in the war the 105's played a crucial part in the bombing missions. The 105-G Wild Weasel, 2 seat version were the first in to take out SAM sites and play a dangers game of chicken with fired SA missiles to clear the way for the Phantoms to make there bombing runs. They would loiter till the F-4's dropped there ordnance and would be the last out.

Thank you for your service to our country Carryall!

David
 

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The military did me a service actually. I needed the discipline as a wild child of 16yrs old, trust me. LOL
 

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My experience is to buy the cheapest bike you can find. When you need service then go to your local dealer and build the relationship. Dealers don't make much profit, if any, selling new bikes under most circumstances, however they make a lot of their money on parts and service. I have never had a dealer snub me because I didn't buy it there, just the opposite, they were grateful for the buisness.

The diference you quoted was over $1000 which buys a lot of parts and service later on.
 

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I took some fairly long rides to visit dealers who were advertising significantly lower prices, and the lower prices were either demo models that customers had been test riding at large dealerships, or the dealer was making up the difference with jacked up freight and prep charges. I looked at one used bike because the price was so low, but it turned out that the dealer had put a few grand into "refurbishing" that was not included in the listed price. It seems pretty shady to me. Before my hair turned grey, we would have run a dealer out of town for demanding twice the advertised price for a vehicle, but this seems to be a fairly common practice nowadays... Anyway, I ended up buying a new bike from the dealer right down the road for the advertised price "out the door," including tax, and with no added freight or prep charges. I'll probably buy another bike from them without looking too far afield in the near future.
 

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I'd like to second the notions:

Take the MSF class on their bikes first.

Take the MSF-ERC (Experienced Rider Course) on whatever bike you get first. I take it every time I get a new different bike.

Get a first bike that is small, easy to handle, used and preferably a naked bike. Small and easy to handle because it takes some getting use to a motorcycle and if you can easily overwhelm yourself with weight/speed. Better to do it on something you can more easily control while you're learning. Used because you may have no idea what kind of bike/style of riding you're going to enjoy the most. There's also a good chance you'll outgrow that first bike and want to move on/up. A used bike can often be sold or traded within a year or two for nearly what you pay for it. Used doesn't mean a "beater" bike. Get one in good condition that's been well maintained. Naked because chances are it's going to be dropped at some point and repainting scratches is much cheaper than replacing $1k worth of plastic.

I share the experiences of others searching on-line for deals. Many dealers practice less than ethical (IMHO) practices of advertising a price that they have no intention of meeting. I spent a few hours on phone chasing these advertised "deals" and you simply have to ask pointedly all of the pertinent questions. "What are the additional costs?" Is the bike available today? They seem to not want to outright lie and will admit setup fees, paperwork fees, etc. Most often I heard "We sold that bike yesterday but we have another for only $Nk more." -or- "We have another one coming, don't know the price yet." One thing about Kawasakis, NOS tends to really bring the price down. My 2014 N1k was $10k OTD (with factory luggage) in September 2015. Oh yeah, buying in fall/winter is best for the deals.

Your idea of getting a local dealer is a good one. If you get a used bike from them, often they'll give you nearly what you paid if you trade it in on something a bit more expensive within a year or so. Some dealers have a fair amount of used stock and others don't really want used bikes.

Whatever you decide, welcome to motorcycling! Good luck and be safe.
 

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I haven't been riding for very long, and even if I had, I'm not the sort to try and tell anyone else what they should or shouldn't do. What I will do is relate my own personal experience and relevant observations. I started on a low mileage, used 250 cc Honda that I got an "already been dropped" discount on. The bike ran great, and still does. I put up with "girl bike" comments and such from the minority of fellow riders for 3 years (most riders I've met have been really great people), but after 3 years on my 250, I can probably outride most of them. My observations: I wasn't afraid to really ride the 250 because it was inexpensive and already scratched and dented, so I wasn't afraid of dropping it (which I did, more than once). Now, it may be different for others, but I think I learned a lot more on that bike than I would have if I had started on the bike I'm riding now. Since it's new, I'm a little more cautious with it, but all the things I learned dropping the 250 apply to my new bike, and I think the experience I gained really contribute to my ability to have a lot of fun with the new bike without stressing about damaging it. The time I spent practicing slow maneuvers in parking lots was well spent, and it didn't take long to build confidence on the new bike at all. From my experience, going fast is easy, but it takes a little thought to understand when not to go fast and a little practice to understand how to properly go slow. For me, starting on a small, inexpensive bike was the best choice, and the experience I gained greatly enhances my enjoyment on my new bike.
 

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I haven't been riding for very long, and even if I had, I'm not the sort to try and tell anyone else what they should or shouldn't do. What I will do is relate my own personal experience and relevant observations. I started on a low mileage, used 250 cc Honda that I got an "already been dropped" discount on. The bike ran great, and still does. I put up with "girl bike" comments and such from the minority of fellow riders for 3 years (most riders I've met have been really great people), but after 3 years on my 250, I can probably outride most of them. My observations: I wasn't afraid to really ride the 250 because it was inexpensive and already scratched and dented, so I wasn't afraid of dropping it (which I did, more than once). Now, it may be different for others, but I think I learned a lot more on that bike than I would have if I had started on the bike I'm riding now. Since it's new, I'm a little more cautious with it, but all the things I learned dropping the 250 apply to my new bike, and I think the experience I gained really contribute to my ability to have a lot of fun with the new bike without stressing about damaging it. The time I spent practicing slow maneuvers in parking lots was well spent, and it didn't take long to build confidence on the new bike at all. From my experience, going fast is easy, but it takes a little thought to understand when not to go fast and a little practice to understand how to properly go slow. For me, starting on a small, inexpensive bike was the best choice, and the experience I gained greatly enhances my enjoyment on my new bike.
Want to add to this after demo riding Harleys yesterday...

Been thinking about what I learned at the Harley demo event... Being perfectly honest, I have always been a little anxious about riding big bikes, having dropped/laid down a few smaller ones. The first Harley I rode was the Fat Bob with the 114 ci. At 1868 cc, it has nearly 3 times the displacement of my Ninja, and it weighs over 650 lbs. dry. I had the back tire break loose in some sand as I throttled around a 45 degree turn because I was trying to keep up with everyone else and didn't want to stop for traffic. It was no different from backing my first bike (a 250 cc) into a turn, even though the Harley weighs more than twice as much. Had I not bashed my 250 for 3 years, I probably would have lowsided, but I instinctively did all the right things without thinking, and it was over before there was time for it to scare me. The experience I gained riding a "girl bike" served me well. I think every rider should start by going full kamikazi on a small bike. Expect to wreck a few times, so get a cheap one to start. People will laugh at you when you lay it down in a parking lot, but it's worth it, and it will make you a better rider than the "experts" who say they have been riding all their lives and never dropped their bikes...

I'm still a little cautious with my new Kawi, but I'm not nearly as afraid of heavy bikes now, mostly thanks to experience gained on my first little bitty bike. To be clear, I feel confident to casually tool down the road on any bike. I'm talking about REALLY riding the damned thing here.
 

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Last new bike I bought I looked at dealers in a 200 mile radius got best deal and then went to local dealer. I told him straight up meet this price toss in a helmet and you will have a loyal customer who will spend a lot of cash with you. he did and I did. I saved hundreds on bike price add in 200 buck helmet I did okay. In long run he got a loyal customer who in the next five years spent as much on add ons and tires and valve adjustments(only mechanical work I let them do). I paid 3200 bucks yrs ago for the only new bike I ever got. I spent over 4 grand on it over the 5-6 yrs I had it. I went through 2-3 sets of tires a year. many quarts of oil and filters in those 5-6 yrs. I put ever add on you can think of over that time. Once about 3 yrs into the ordeal we talked and he said he made the best deal of his career and had done so many time later with others. Repeat customers not only keep[ him alive our referrals to guys as him being fair and honest put money in his pocket. if you refer a guy or gal always make sure they let the management know why they came, you sent them. I actually got a few deals over the years on new stuff or discount stuff as I sent a lot of friends to him. I also di some damage to local honda dealer as they treated me bad and would not make any deal. I know their manager, he knows what I spend on my bikes, all kawasakis for the last 15 years. Dealers are across the street from each other, I always beep and wave at honda guys when I pass by on my kawi's LOL.They lost a good customer forever with their bad attitude, and they know it. I also warned many other riders of their crap.
 

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Want to add to this after demo riding Harleys yesterday...

Been thinking about what I learned at the Harley demo event... Being perfectly honest, I have always been a little anxious about riding big bikes, having dropped/laid down a few smaller ones. The first Harley I rode was the Fat Bob with the 114 ci. At 1868 cc, it has nearly 3 times the displacement of my Ninja, and it weighs over 650 lbs. dry. I had the back tire break loose in some sand as I throttled around a 45 degree turn because I was trying to keep up with everyone else and didn't want to stop for traffic. It was no different from backing my first bike (a 250 cc) into a turn, even though the Harley weighs more than twice as much. Had I not bashed my 250 for 3 years, I probably would have lowsided, but I instinctively did all the right things without thinking, and it was over before there was time for it to scare me. The experience I gained riding a "girl bike" served me well. I think every rider should start by going full kamikazi on a small bike. Expect to wreck a few times, so get a cheap one to start. People will laugh at you when you lay it down in a parking lot, but it's worth it, and it will make you a better rider than the "experts" who say they have been riding all their lives and never dropped their bikes...

I'm still a little cautious with my new Kawi, but I'm not nearly as afraid of heavy bikes now, mostly thanks to experience gained on my first little bitty bike. To be clear, I feel confident to casually tool down the road on any bike. I'm talking about REALLY riding the damned thing here.
Great advice I luckily learned at young age on friend's yamaha 60 dirt bike, I fell many times and it made me a much better rider. I spent years in dirt before I was old enough for first road bike, I got a honda xl 125 at 14 when I got my license. For youngsters a honda xl is dual sport endure type 4 stroke single with knobbies and lights from the late 70's. I could ride to school and to the dirt tracks we rode on. Best of both worlds. I always felt learning young on dirt bike is best, hard to get hurt in dirt on small dirt bikes compared to streets with cars and curbs and concrete.
 

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hi,,,hope this doesnt make anyone ???? in my opinion...if you are riding a bike and have an accident...i will say that 95%+ of the time it is bike driver error...you can not trust the corner stop sign to stop a car...you have to look for it...remember to check their wheels... if they are moving watch em...being in the wrong position is a big one...using the brakes wrong can put you down....and me i love my street racing...shooting curves...going thru the gears stop signs but im running small displacement bikes and running them full tilt...back roads,, sub divisions lots of curves... donmobay south of atlanta
 
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