Seat comparo: Stock vs Sargent vs Seth Laam

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Seat comparo: Stock vs Sargent vs Seth Laam

This is a discussion on Seat comparo: Stock vs Sargent vs Seth Laam within the 4th Gen Z1000/Ninja 1000 forums, part of the Kawasaki Z1000, Ninja 1000, Z800, Z750 & Z-750S category; Way late to the table and there's plenty of seat talk elsewhere but since the same seat still fits the current Ninja 1000 model and ...

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Thread: Seat comparo: Stock vs Sargent vs Seth Laam

  1. #1
    Supreme Being kenors's Avatar
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    Seat comparo: Stock vs Sargent vs Seth Laam

    Way late to the table and there's plenty of seat talk elsewhere but since the same seat still fits the current Ninja 1000 model and the frost is being melted by the rain...

    I recently picked up a Seth Laam seat from a forum member (thanks to whynot) and had a chance to put a few hundred miles on it. I'd originally gone from stock to Sargent (within a week!) and was relatively happy with the Sargent but my older a$$ was getting a bit abused on 10 hour + days in the saddle so when the Seth Laam came up and the price was right, it was the holidays so Merry Christmas to me.

    Brief history...bought a 2011 Ninja in 2013, the OEM seat lasted a week. Sore spots developed within an hour, Sargent here we come. I've had Sargents previously on 4 VFRs since 1991. I always ride in an Aerostitch suit. Put 42k miles on the '11 N1k, totaled it, got a '14 and transferred the Sargent to the '14 which now has 53k miles on it. I'm 5' 8" w/ 31" inseam and in late late late late middle age...

    I've been 95% happy with Sargent. They make their own seat pans and the shape is perfect and if it had just a bit more padding I'd never have even thought about another seat. In spite of it's perfect shape, it feels like the Sargent has about 1/4" of padding. I don't get any specific hot spots but overall my butt gets tired and a bit sore after several hours. It's very much helped by the fact I can shift my position on the Sargent, sliding forward or back which changes the feel of the seat. The covering on the Sargent is quite slippery with textiles. That surprised me because my VFR seats all were great. Sargent use to ask if you wore textiles or leather and they had a seat cover that wasn't so slippery for textiles. They didn't ask this time and I didn't think to mention it. It's not so slippery 5 years and 90k miles later but still more so than the Laam seat. Also, at 90k miles the Sargent still looks and feels like new. The materials they use are top notch, if thin. I have a piece of sheep skin that I put on the seat, particularly when it's going to be hot. For me, that extends the Sargent comfort factor to "all day."

    The Seth Laam seat came and it might as well have been brand new. It looks awesome. Mounting it, I noticed a small gap between the seat and tank. Normally my heated suit wires are pinched between the seat and tank, now they're loose. No biggie, just an observation. It might help keep tank vibration out of the seat. It's built on the oem seat pan and it's hard to believe because the shape is so different. It's shaped almost exactly like the Sargent but with padding. The one exception is that the front of the seat is built up just enough that you don't slide forward to the tank. It's more of a single position seat and your butt sits a couple inches back from the tank. But that single position (so far) is very comfortable for me. I haven't done any long days yet but in a non-stop 3 hour 150 mile ride I never thought about my backside once. The seat is comfy. Assuming good materials that don't break down with heat or time, this is likely going to be an all day comfy seat.

    Note: Between gen3 and gen4 Ninjas a cross bar was added to the frame that interferes with a couple of "nubs" that stick down on gen3 seat pans. Grind these off and all 2011-present seats fit the same. These "nubs" were present on the earliest Sargent seat pans as well.

    The Seth Laam seat looks bulkier and heavier than the stock or Sargent seat. I didn't weigh them but I had one in each hand and didn't really feel any difference in weight.

    Finally, with the thicker padding I wondered about getting both feet down with the Seth Laam seat. Not enough difference here to notice either.
    whynot likes this.
    2014 Ninja w/bags, Motowerks lowered pegs, Sargent Seat, Vstream tour screen, Givi XS306 tank bag, WOLO BadBoy, Aerostitch Roadcrafter.

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    Newbie trialsguy's Avatar
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    I've read on a forum somewhere - that you can unbolt that rear sub-frame brace, turn it upsidedown, and bolt it back in. That way you won't have to grind nubs off the bottom of the seat pan.

    I have a '16, with a stock seat. But may go to something else one day. Maybe a Sargent. I recently added Murphs bar risers. That may change the feel of the seat now. But I will have to wait for the snow to melt before putting some miles down to see.

  3. #3
    Newbie Talonz's Avatar
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    This thread needs pics.

    I have a sarget on mine, love it. I can imagine there is some room for improvement, but I dont want anything taller or harder to hang off.

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    Supreme Being kenors's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trialsguy View Post
    I've read on a forum somewhere - that you can unbolt that rear sub-frame brace, turn it upsidedown, and bolt it back in. That way you won't have to grind nubs off the bottom of the seat pan.
    My bike's apart in the garage right now and I don't think this is true. The seat nubs hit the flat part of the brace, not the upward turned fin. What you can do is toss the brace altogether. It does stiffen the frame a bit but my initial reaction to the seat not fitting was to remove that brace. While I didn't notice any difference in the bike's behavior, the more I thought about the more my engineering side told me that it was there for a reason.
    2014 Ninja w/bags, Motowerks lowered pegs, Sargent Seat, Vstream tour screen, Givi XS306 tank bag, WOLO BadBoy, Aerostitch Roadcrafter.

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    Supreme Being kenors's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talonz View Post
    This thread needs pics.
    Ask and yea shall receive.

    Seat Tops.jpg

    Seat Bottoms.jpg '14 Stock seat: no nubbins. Sargent seat: I carefully sanded them off. Seth Lamm: nubbins munched off by beavers!

    Seat-Stock1.jpg A surprise from the pics: You can see the sharp angles in the stock seat that make it so painful after a while.

    Seat-Sargent1.jpg Note the red welt customized for me by Sargent. After riding red VFRs from 1992-2012 I didn't think I could find the bike if there wasn't some red on it!

    Seat-Seth Lamm1.jpg Seth Lamm totally hides the stock seat pan and re-contours the seating area.
    Last edited by kenors; 02-26-19 at 05:01 PM.
    2014 Ninja w/bags, Motowerks lowered pegs, Sargent Seat, Vstream tour screen, Givi XS306 tank bag, WOLO BadBoy, Aerostitch Roadcrafter.

  7. #6
    Newbie 450fizz's Avatar
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    Aren't the kawa gel seat come hot staying in the sun?
    rcannon409 likes this.

  8. #7
    Newbie 450fizz's Avatar
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    These posts confuse me even more. Stock seat numbs parts of my body that can't be mentioned. Sergeants sound hard but comfortable with a pocket, but no rear seat, just cover. Corbin looks puffy. Gel kawa seats afraid will come hot in sun. What is the perfect seat?? Lol

  9. #8
    Supreme Being rcannon409's Avatar
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    I hated the sargent seat I had years back. Stock was bad. The gel was ok. Better than stock, maybe, but mine got super hot in the sun. Worse yet, the gel seat would hold that heat for hours.

    This winter, Sargent had a sale on seats. Although I did not like my first one, or second they were a slight improvement over stock. I ordered my third sargent thinking Id get it, then modify it. When I ordered Sargent 3 I decided to do the custom cover. In their options list you can choose from a few different options. I decided ot get a non welt, and have the seating area covered in their DTX fabric. Kenors, correct me if I'm wrong but the DTX is the grip material as I recall. 20.00 extra so no big deal.

    Anyway, "DTX and no welt" I know Ill sound like an idiot, but I'll be honest. This seat excellent. I dont feel that defined pocket, and the sticky cover lets sit where I want to. Its really not sticky, just "non slip", if that makes any sense. No sliding forward or back.

    I will contact them and see if their design changed between sgt 1 and 2 (2013) and sgt 3 (2019). I cant explain why this newer seat feels so much better, other than the different cover. I have a sgt seat on my concours 14. Im going to see about having it recovered in the dtx material.
    Last edited by rcannon409; 05-21-19 at 09:31 AM.
    2012 Ninja 1000 all green - Brembo 330mm rotors - AK20 fork cartridges -Penske shock-slipper -Ivans reflash...Leo Vince slip on and Arrow header

  10. #9
    Supreme Being kenors's Avatar
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    I agree, particularly with a textile suit, their standard cover is pretty slippery. I have enough miles on mine that it is not as slippery as new but still slicker than the DTX cover they offer. I forgot to ask when I ordered so I got the default stuff and it doesn't bother me as much as it does rcannon. I wouldn't be surprised if the design changed a little. I and a boatload of others complained of the ultra-thin padding and maybe all they did was add a bit more. Shape wise I like it. Sliding forward or back gives you completely different pressure points and for long rides, varying the pressure points is what it's all about for comfort.
    Glad you found seat nirvana for the N1k.
    2014 Ninja w/bags, Motowerks lowered pegs, Sargent Seat, Vstream tour screen, Givi XS306 tank bag, WOLO BadBoy, Aerostitch Roadcrafter.

  11. #10
    Ydo
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    I had The same Sargent in kenors pictures with the same red welt and it is only marginally better than the stock seat for me. 50 miles and I'm squirming and fighting my butt counting the miles to my next stop. I now have a BMW S1000XR with the low suspension and seat option and it is way better. The Ninja seats are too narrow and just not the right shape. The Lamm seat looks more like the shape and width that I would need.

    PS: Still have my 2011 Ninja. I love the engine braking and power band it has even though the bimmer has way more power (165 hp) the difference is not so notable.

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