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New Tires

20K views 139 replies 27 participants last post by  Squidlius 
#1 · (Edited)
I had been impatiently waiting for the new Metzeler M7RRs to become available here and it finally looks like they are. Even though I have a brand new Q3 waiting to go on the front of my N1K, I just ordered a M7RR. Those idiots at MCN liked the M7RRs better than what I believe is the equivalent to our Dunlop Q3s and those are great tires. If the M7RRs work only as good as the Q3s and last a little longer while feeling good to the end, it'll be a nice tire for sure. They have the typical Metzeler price though so unless they do feel great and last longer than the Q3s, I won't buy another. I just have to know for myself what they feel like and how long they last.
 
#2 ·
I got one short ride on my new M7RR's. Too cold to say anything about traction but so far they are feeling like a vast improvement over the BT16's as far as holding a line, on the brakes or on the gas. They feel very similar to the M5's I had on my previous bike. I'm hearing performance drops off near the end of their life but most tires do.

Curious to hear what you think.
 
#3 · (Edited)
The question is always how badly they drop off near the end. That's what I love about the Q3s. If you keep them from getting flat by riding a lot of twisties, they still work great at the wear bars. If these M7RRs drop off as badly as the Michelins do, that'll be yet another reason to stick with my trusty Dunlops.

Keep me posted on what you think of them. The MCN guys got all wet over them. I get mine in 4 days.

Motorrad was pretty fond of the M7RRs as well.
 
#5 ·
It might just be the next, better PP3 or Q3. I'm looking forward to trying it (since I just run the front).
 
#6 ·
My new tires arrived and the first thing I did was put the M7RR next to my new Q3 for comparison. The M7RR is taller and maybe a smidge narrower looking very much like a PP3. I'm excited because I really liked the way the PP3 felt when it was brand new. I just hope this M7RR feels as good as the Q3 at the end. My Q3 front and T30 rear have been well into the wear bars for a while. All I'm doing is commuting and short hill rides so I'm running them down to nothing just to see what they feel like. The bike still feels great, turns without any weirdness and the tires still stick confidently. I'm looking forward to wearing out this M7RR to see how it does.
 
#10 ·
So are you just running the rear M7RR with some other front?

....
 
#7 ·
I'm going to order a set of M7RRs to put on next. I like these Q3s a lot, but I'm looking at 2500 miles if I'm lucky on them. ~1550 miles and they're probably down to 50% tread. A friend that has them as well said he thinks his Q3s are wearing out very quickly too, and his bike is a 600 and he doesn't quite ride as rough as I do. I have another set of Q3s already, but I'm thinking about saving those for a track day. Even thinking about ordering the M7RRs and putting them on before these Q3s are thrashed. They'd be great for a track day yet but not with any more wear.
 
#20 · (Edited)
So I've been trying to hold off on mounting my new tires until next month for my favorite 4 day ride into the Sierra mountains. In the mean time I've been trying to find direct comparisons between the M7RRs and the Q3s. I finally found one and was a little bummed that they preferred the Q3s at the edge of the envelope. Oh well, looks like the Q3 will remain my go-to front tire for a while longer.

Q3 vs M7RR


edit: I just realized those knuckleheads at ultimatemotorcycling didn't mention any lap times, the only true gauge. He merely states that he thought he "looked" faster from comparing video of himself? I can't believe they even posted that. lol
 
#21 ·
You'd be safe to go to M7s. 2015 Sport Motorcycle Tire Shootout Conclusion - Motorcycle USA includes Q3s and M5s. They ran two tracks, and the M5s were within 2.3 or less at both tracks. I'm sure M7s would perform even better/closer.

Apparently the real performance tire to have is the Supercorsa V2s if you really want the ultimate supersport street tire.

I'll be putting my M7s on in the next couple weeks. I won't really have any objective testing for them. Basically if they have the same feel (lighter steering/quicker turn-in) that's all I'm really looking for compared to the M5s. So if they last 4-5k miles, and have the same feel as the Q3s I'll like them. I'm pretty sure as far as ultimate levels of grip, I'm not really pushing any threshholds there.

I'll have both sets of tires unmounted side-by-side. I might take some pics just to do some comparison. I'd like to measure their tread profiles somehow, but not really sure how to do so accurately.
 
#22 · (Edited)
Yeah, if the M7RR has a nice feel to it and lasts as long or better yet a bit longer than a Q3, I may try another.

The Supercorsas are amazing but as I mentioned elsewhere, I hit the side wear bars on my latest front in 1000 miles which is absurd! They're great tires but just wear out way too fast to be a viable street tire. I'm gonna start running Q3s on my 675 from now on. They stick almost as good, last longer and are less expensive.

I put the two tires side by side. It's always interesting to see the difference in profiles. The M7RRs look a lot like a Pilot Power 3. Narrower and taller (lighter steering, quicker fall in) than the Q3s.
 
#23 · (Edited)
So FINALLY I'm close enough to my 4 day ride and I went ahead and mounted my new tires. Man were my old ones done! It's always surprising to see just how ugly they are when you put them side by side with new ones. They felt great considering how worn and squared off they were.

Going to the top of my hill and back is a nice 45 mile tire scrub in ride. The Q3 (and to a slightly lesser extent the PP3) is ready to do stoppies after just a couple of miles. The M7RR requires about twice that before it's ready to lift the rear wheel on the brakes. The first time I tried it yelped and started to lock up. That made me start to worry but I thought, Geez, chill and give it a few more miles. So I relaxed and just cruised the remaining mile to the bottom of my hill getting on the gas and on the brakes as hard as I could without making the tire howl. I start up the hill and think, Hmmm, this thing's profile feels like it's right in between a Q3 and a PP3. When brand new, the PP3 is the best for trail braking into corners, standing the bike up the least. The Q3 is almost as good, the M7RR likes trail braking the least, standing the bike up the most. It's not a problem, I just have to remember to not trail brake as hard into corners if I can help it. Maybe it'll get better as I start to trust it more, I'll find out soon. It doesn't feel like a cat on carpet the way a Q3 and PP3 feel but it's not bad. I think I'll like it well enough that I won't be sorry I tried it. After hearing about how the M7RR has softer sidewalls, I was expecting it to be feel noticeably more compliant over bumps but I couldn't feel a difference over the Q3. I only noticed it's not quite as stable charging into corners on the brakes.

I'm looking forward to seeing how long it lasts and how it feels at the end. After a few more miles on the hill, the M7RR lifted the rear wheel on the brakes without drama so I was happy. I got to the edges of the T30 and had an 1/8" chicken strip on the M7RR when I got back down. The tires are ready to go! :)





 
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#33 ·
Squidlius: Thanks for sharing the route. Not sure how I missed it but 130 looks like one heckofa route. Next time south it's going to be in the plan.
 
#34 · (Edited)
For me, running up to the Lick Observatory at the top and back is a nice 1 hour ride.

Continuing down the backside of 130 into the San Antonio Valley is the best local ride in the area. It's like dropping into Wyoming. It's hard to believe you're still right next to the Bay Area. At the Junction you can turn east on Del Puerto Canyon Rd and take that out to Patterson on I5 for gas/lunch and/or continue north on Mines Rd into Livermore. From Livermore I take Calaveras Rd back to Milpitas. A very nice 155 mile loop.

If you or anyone else is ever in the area, look me up if you'd like me to drag you on a bunch of cool roads. :)


 
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#35 ·
Hello,

If I could ask for an opinion here. I have a 2012 N1K with a set of Michelin Pilot Road 4s. The rear tire is coming to the end of its life after about 6K miles of highway and weekend canyon strafing. A little disappointed with how long they lasted but it's not that bad. The PR4 was a fine tire but I have noticed that in the canyons, the steering is heavier than the previous tires (Avons AV80s). I was thinking of going with a Pirelli Angel GT but now i fear that the high silica content will again result in heavy steering in the turns. I like what I read on the Metzeler M7RRs but any opinions on how long they may last on a bike like the N1K?
 
#37 ·
6000 seems fairly short for what I read about PR4s. I'm putting M7RRs on my 14R next, have them all mounted up ready to install but have a couple hundred miles on my Q3s left. I was thinking about trying PR4s next but definitely want something with the super sport profile, I like the Q3s aggressive profile.

M7RRs are supposed to last 20% longer than M5s. My stock M5s lasted 4400 miles to the wear marker. Granted, for the first couple thousand miles I wasn't really capable of really "using up" the tires, and I now ride much more aggressively. I'm hoping the M7RRs will last 4-5k miles. My Q3s are going to last 2500 miles about exactly (no burn outs).
 
#36 ·
Wow 6k out of tires I would think is on the high side for this bike.

IMHO high silica content will not affect steering effort. That is up to the profile of the tire, the belt strategy used in the tire, and the pressure run by the end user.

The silica content changes how the tire works in adverse weather.
 
#40 ·
That's the compromise indeed....

I do like to have fun, but not the point where i'm dragging knees or something like that. I had read that the N1K naturally felt a little heavy flicking between turns. I can attest that statement is accurate. Ive always used the 190/55 tire and sport touring tires. I do about 8K miles per year just being a weekend warrior so there's value in having a longer lasting tire.

I should probably check the sag and play with the suspension settings to see if that helps. In the meantime, the front tire is only about 3K miles into its life. If I got a rear tire like the M7RR, am I wasting it by keeping the PR4 front tire?

Thank you for your earlier comments.
 
#43 · (Edited)
Judging from this statement, honestly I'd throw on another PR4 and call it good.


Hey, I got nearly14k out of my PR4s and I have lots of fun on the bike!
I know, I know.....fun is relative. :)

For me it is astonishing that you got 14,000 miles out of your PR4s. I truly would have never believed that was possible without you telling me. I know it's not humanly possible for that to occur given the manner in which I operate 2 wheeled vehicles!
 
#42 ·
You had fun in that 14k miles? Im almost to 11k and I I just put my 5th rear tire on. With 0 burnouts. Everyone has fun differently I suppose. Or perhaps the pr4s are just that good. hmm..
 
#44 ·
We've been 'round & 'round on PR4's and what constitutes fun. The two factors that add longevity to my PR4's are: Most riding done in cool, sometimes damp weather and I rarely ride above 7/10ths any more. Same road choice, different pace...

It started out because I could no longer do 9/10s and ride sunup to sundown but a nice side effect is everything (body, bike, tires, etc.) lasts longer. It's my personal choice (of which the wife approves) to slow down and keep going vs BTTW until you hit the end. Similar reason to giving up dirt riding. It takes too darn long to heal nowadays.

Speaking of MC fun and what constitutes it...I just got back from MI where my cousin is a huge motorcycle fan. He'll talk motorcycles or airplanes (has one of those too) all day long with enthusiasm. He rides it to rallys in the midwest & puts maybe 2k miles a year on it. To quote him: "There is nothing like the feeling of cruising down the freeway with a hundred other riders." Different strokes, eh?
 
#45 · (Edited)
Just to be perfectly clear here for the record, I am not and will never dis you or anyone for how they choose to ride their bikes. You are definitely a "rider" and I have mad respect for all fellow riders. I was not trying to imply that you are "slow" or don't have any "fun". I admire folks who can do it at a slower pace.

My comments on tires simply center around the fact that I go through them like Friday morning doughnuts and I can't see that changing. Everything in my life is like a methamphetamine addiction. I just HAVE to go fast in everything I do, all the time. Not because I'm late or in a hurry or trying to say that you're slow or challenging your manhood by implying mine is bigger than yours (this is the biggest problem most of the time) but simply because I just love to and have an unyielding drive to do everything fast. I was born to race. Period. I can't smell the roses or admire the scenery. I can only focus on the road and my bike as it becomes an extension of my body. I ride to go around corners as fast as I can without crashing and have been doing that on the street for over 40 years.

When I was younger it was definitely a race against others. Now it's just a race against myself. I know I won't be able to do this forever ("don't worry son, you'll grow up and mature" my father used to say) but much to everyone's chagrin, that process is taking much, much longer than everyone thought it would. :)

I've really tried hard to ride with slower groups but end up getting anxiety attacks. I have a problem so I just go with it and don't try to fight it. I've always thought that maybe if I bought a Hardly Ableson it would help curb my affliction.
 
#47 ·
Tire was suddenly fully up, and had no time to wait for an other PP3 ... so I put on the Dunlop Sportsmart 2. (only tire in stock in 190/55)

First feedback: I miss the tire shape of my PP3. Grip seems to be good tho. Haven't been able to test feedback yet, as it was a ride on wet roads, en when they finally dried up, I came to the known my front brake pads where fully gone (a bit faster then expected).

2.5 weeks with these, and then Metzler M7 RR front & rear.

Will be testing more other tires, as I'm disappointed in the of the lack of grip of a worn PP3.
 
#48 ·
Grip seems to be good tho. Haven't been able to test feedback yet, as it was a ride on wet roads, en when they finally dried up, I came to the known my front brake pads where fully gone (a bit faster then expected).
Given how fast you go through tires, this doesn't surprise me. what kind of mileage/KM did you get out of that front pad set?
 
#55 ·
I leave for my 4 day acid test Friday morning but so far I'm liking my M7RR/T30 combo. The M7RR is a little squirrely hard on the brake but it turns in like a scalpel and transitions very nicely. It also seems to like to follow road irregularities more than the Q3 or PP3.
 
#57 ·
They do and they’re great tires. A little slow steering with their flatter profile but great tires.

A little history to catch you up. There are two distinct groups found on here. Guys who only run sport tires and are willing to sacrifice tire life for performance and guys who run sport touring tires because tire life is what matters.

For tire life, the two top tires in my humble opinion are the Pilot Road 4s and the Angel GTs. The other sport touring tires may not last as long but they all have their merits as well.

For sport tires you pretty much have had the Dunlop Q3s and the Michelin Pilot Power 3s. The M7RRs are the newest addition to this group.

The problem for me personally is I go through 1.5 sport rear tires for every sport front. Since I always change my tires together for 100% of that sweet new tire feeling, it’s a problem throwing away a front tire that still has 1000 miles left in it. Hence my sport/sport touring tire combos. I look for the best handling, shortest lasting sport touring rear tire in hopes that it’ll wear out at the same pace as my sport front tire. A Q3/T30 combo has achieved that the best to date but the Q3 still wears out a bit before the T30 on my N1K. This new M7RR is supposed to work well and last decently so I’m trying one now to see if performance is acceptable and if it wears out at the same rate as my T30 rear.

I'm liking the combo very much so far but I'll know for sure after I get back from 4 days of torture testing in the Sierra Mountains. :)
 
#58 ·
about the Angel, 2 mates on Multistrada's both, prefer them above the PR4's.
But the Mutlistrada then also seems not to prefer a Michelin front tire (my dealer said today). No idea why.

I can't put up the budget for 2 new tires at once scheme anymore :( Too much budget would go wasted.
1.9 rears for each front atm. Sport tires.

Sport rear tire lasted 2400 km, sport touring rear tire 3400-3600km (PR3 & Z8), so Squidus his 1.5 ratio seems correct (under spirited riding).
On a positive note my last sport rear tire lasted 3000km. those few slippy rides at the end of the season seems to be a heaven's gift for tire life :D

about the sport vs sport touring discussion, i see a lot of mileages where I would guess the rider would be better of with sport touring tires.
They have great grip & great feedback.
Not to nag about usage, each his own, but if you get +6000km out of a sport tire, then I guess you are not using its full capacity & would feel not so much difference with a sport touring tire.
That is my honest opinion, based upon my riding style when I still did 3700-3900km with a PP3 (& did not use its full grip capacity) (and 6800km with a PR3)

To each his own ofcourse, & tire confidence may not be underestimated, nor will it be judged.
I'm silently wishing that my tire mileages would improve too, the holy crap factor is long gone, and now it really starts to weight on the budget. (brakes & other stuff too).
Even my gloves seem to wear off faster then the average.
 
#60 ·
Interesting. IMO tires people like is a really subjective thing. I could go on about how guys toss ST tires on their sport bikes and have no problems riding around in intermediate or even advance groups at track days, and how they are more tire than what most could ever dream of outriding, but it ultimately comes down to how you ride, and where you ride. I'm not a big pr3 or 4 fan - I've ridden on them on a different bike and I agreed that they felt a little squirmy. I've had nothing but Michelin tires on my gsxr, although I just put Q3's on it and man is that a great feeling tire (just in time to sell it though)... I'm looking forward to putting a set of angels on my ninja when the stockers are done, if nothing for trying something new. I'll be curious to see the kinda mileage you guys get out of these combos and what you think of them when they start getting some miles on them :)
 
#61 ·
Interesting. IMO tires people like is a really subjective thing. I could go on about how guys toss ST tires on their sport bikes and have no problems riding around in intermediate or even advance groups at track days, and how they are more tire than what most could ever dream of outriding, but it ultimately comes down to how you ride, and where you ride. I'm not a big pr3 or 4 fan - I've ridden on them on a different bike and I agreed that they felt a little squirmy. I've had nothing but Michelin tires on my gsxr, although I just put Q3's on it and man is that a great feeling tire (just in time to sell it though)... I'm looking forward to putting a set of angels on my ninja when the stockers are done, if nothing for trying something new. I'll be curious to see the kinda mileage you guys get out of these combos and what you think of them when they start getting some miles on them :)
You got that right. I know how fast you can go on sport touring tires, I do it on my N1K and I've chased fast riders who use them. It is faster than most can go. It still cracks me up though every time I see a guy post about how his Pilot Road 4s blow away the sport tires he had on there. 90% of the time they forget or don't even know about how bad tires feel at the end and how great ANY new tire feels. It is all highly subjective and all that matters is that the guy is happy with his new tires.
 
#62 ·
haha - the "new" tire feel is awesome, and totally agree. I had PP Pures on my GSXR and while I hated the things (both on the street and on the track) in terms of feel, they stuck just fine. Hell, I even got around 4500 miles out of them. Put the Q3's on this spring and I spent most of my time going "holy sh*t" and trying to remember what the pures felt like new. I pretty much came to the conclusion the Q3's are probably the best feeling new tire I've ever put on the bike.

I'll be curious to see how the angels do on the N1000 - I don't ride crazy on the street, so longevity is a bit more important, regardless of the fact I'll probably end up doing a track day or 2 this year on the ninja.
 
#64 ·
If the wife and I suddenly got the chance to take that ride around the US, it'd be on a set of Angel GTs.
 
#65 ·
I have the same strategy. Different tires for different periods of riding. If I plan a long trip with some slabs of freeway then I'll get some throw away bridgstones or something touring. If I'm just going to be having fun on twisties for the next month or two I'll get q3s every time. Most confidence inspiring tires I've ever had.
 
#66 ·
Suddenly I feel like I'm beating a dead horse and don't really even feel like writing blah, blah, blah but what the hell. Skip it if you're tired of it....

After 4 days of not quite the usually pace (the group was a little subdued this year, probably due to the two crashes we had last year. Doh!), the guys were all commenting on how my M7RR front looked brand new next to their Q3s. The tire performed flawlessly, warmed up quickly, felt good in the wet and stuck as confidently in the dry as I was willing to go on bumpy dirty mountain roads. My N1K steers very nicely with a light tip in and neutral feel. Trail braking has improved for me as well, I just lean harder trailing the front brake and it confidently scrubs off speed. It seems to feel better and better as it wears which is really cool. It's definitely gonna last longer than my Q3s do. If it continues to feel this good til the end, it'll be my new go-to front tire for my N1K. I'd imagine a pair of M7RRs would feel fabulous.
 
#69 ·
Trail braking has improved for me as well, I just lean harder trailing the front brake and it confidently scrubs off speed.
Sounds like these are a winner. Trail braking, rear end dancing, and still be able to turn-in is a definite confidence booster.

After a couple thousand miles this past week in West Virginia, I'm loving the M7's.
Where in West VA? I'm routing a 39/250/33 route for Sunday. I heard miles of 250 were gravel, on the VA side.
 
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